Headlights not working - HELP!

[My S is a wife beater]

None of my headlights nor tail light work. When the light switch is on side or full the indicators don't work. When light switch is in off position indicators work but flash rapidly as they would with a bulb out. Brake light works. Both main bulbs and tail bulb checked and OK. Fuses ok. Not sure how to remove front running light so not checked. All relays seem to be OK. Waggled wire under ignition barrel as per sage advice on this forum - no joy. I have had ongoing problem with starter relay - i'm on my 5th and on 2nd relief relay. Pidcocks did replace an indicator assembley in recent £570 61,000 mile service (rear bearing went for the second time).
This is defintely a "Friday S".
I can see from this forum the collective wisdom is impressive.
Can someone please suggest what might need looking at - I'm not very electrically minded so please keep it simple (ideally not as simple as "take it to a BMW dealer and wait to have bottom spanked and pockets emptied...")
Many thanks

[r550s]

...5th starter relay...2nd l/s relay? Something going off there I should say. Might have a read of me wiring diagram tonight when I have a beer. What was the 'indicator assembly' that was replaced?

[timbox2]

Hello and welcome to the forum. Tricky one, auto electrics aint my strong point either, but it does remind me of a similar problem I had with a tin box a few years back and that ended up being caused by just a bad earth connection, now, not having a wiring diagram cant really help much further. Maybe not a BM dealer but think you need the help of an auto electric wizard, remember seeing an article in a bike mag somewhere about a mobile guy but cant remember name or such like, Im sure someone with more knowledge than I, ( only had mine a month) will be along soon, but in the mean time you might tell us a bit more about your ownership experience as you could have knowledge useful to other forum users having a bike with a fair bit of mileage, so, pull up a chair, chill and talk boxer bollox, sure it'll get sorted.

[Paul]

Hi MSIAWB and welcome to the forums.

just a hunch, but it could be the old "wires exiting fuse/relay podules, rubbing on frame and breaking" problem. If you whip off the front fairings, take a nosey around the fuse/relay boxes for signs of corroded/broken wires. it would look something like this:



Hope this helps,

Cheers,

Paul

[r550s]

definitely with the 'bad-earth' possibility. currents that decide to take their own route can knack components. Something's not right with your bike (hello Sybil Fawlty - specialist subject; the bleedin' obvious) and rubbed wires seem likely. Hard to find, but cheap to fix. Now where's me beer...

[oyster]

I would go with bad earth theory. Chaffing wire would give you an intermittant problem that would upset relays. If you are taking the covers off anyway, try these. Run a wire from battery -VE to the metal shroud of the bulb or holder, kill switch off, ignition on, lights on. If it lights it is a bad earth. Check cabling connectors, including those inside the front of the right hand fuse tray. Remove and emery the connecting surfaces of the earth ( -ve) wires to the battery and frame, give them a coat of silicone grease.
What is the 'relief relay' for?

[My S is a wife beater]

Thanks to everyone who took the time to reply - and thanks for the useful info!
Inspired with a few things to try I whipped the plastics off yet again. The first thing I wanted to try was check that the replacement relay I had (bought in July from Pidcocks to keep with my spare bulbs "just in case") used to replace the relief relay one was working - turns out I was supplied a dud - so by swapping the horn relay my lights now work but my horn doesn't (keep it clean!). Problem solved! Quick call to Motorworks and the very helpful Darren, and 3 relays will be in the post so I should have some spares. So I'm now on my third Relief relay - which by the way powers the headlights. I discoverd this with the help of "The Boxerman" in Leicester 2 years ago when my headlight failed 2 days before heading for France. Pidcocks couldn't fit me in for weeks and couldn't promise any results anyway! Not a great solution and not an easy roadside fix. If i didn't find the damn bike so perfect for my needs in everyother way I would have parted with it long ago - and still think I should but like a beaten wife - I keep coming back for more. I just think it looks great (from most angles) and when it isn't going wrong it is such a great bike.
I think you guys are right - there is something amiss that is casuing these problems but I think I'll get lots of teeth sucking and head shaking and money requiring for someone proffessional to investigate.

For interest/amusement my tale of woe is;

Bought used approved from Jefferies with about 36k on the clock Feb 2003. Didn't mention it had no Licence plate light for some reason(?) was fitted at a later service for £50 without being asked. Apparently it's an MOT advisory - not failure.

In first year - starter motor did something wrong - breakdown guy said water had got in and shorted it (?) drained battery and needed replacing - done under warrenty. As part of this front mudguard damaged by recovery guy. Replaced by BMW after many phone calls and un-gracefully conceeded.

Day after warrenty ran out (literally) ECU failed. Needed replacing - Pidcocks offered second hand one at £300. Went for Motorworks one at about £220. BMW did not entertain warrenty claim despite the fact I had contacted dealer during warrenty period complaining it was cutting out and was told probably a fuel filter and it would be sorted in next service.

Fuel pump stopped activating when key turned. Could still ride it but took about 10 minutes of turning the key on and off until the pump kicked in to start. Pidcocks couldn't fit me in for a couple of months and reluctantly offered to hold onto it and look if time allowed. As is my only form of transport not really a solution. Local workshop I used for other bikes but not keen on Beamers offered to look reluctantly but solved almost immediatly by swapping relays. Now on the 5th fuel pump relay.

Crack appeared in fork brace by pinch bolts. Pidcocks indifferent, Balderstone offered to pursue with BMW GB. I had to conceed for paying labour for repair (£200+) and BMW "paying" for part after extensive correspondence. Still not sure why I should have paid for any of that.

Rear wheel bearing went in France - fixed by BMW in Orleans. Great service and part of cost paid by travel insurance - including hotel for the night. Bearing went again less than 6000 miles later and so cost £570 for 61,000 service - also an indicator has alegedly given up the ghost.

3 weeks before going to France last year rear brake was binding on - failure of rear-master cylinder. Pidcocks unable to fit me in (to be fair looked at it and had it been an easy fix mighy have tried) over the next 3 weeks. 2 other bike shops refused to do BMW's. Eventually CMC agreed to do it but lost the replacement sent by Motorworks and I picked it up at 5pm Saturday afternoon before heading to France at 2am the following morning.

Braided Goodridge brake line frayed but was replaced with no quibles and strait away by Goodridge but I paid for Pidcocks to do the work. (Balderstone fitted them in the first place).

Apart from this the usual finish flaking faster than a leper in a jacuzzi, brake calipers binding, front wheel bearings going. Front disks rattling and the odd fuse blowing!

I must admit it doesn't seem like much when listed but it does seem to have a dispraportionate amount of down time when I've been trying to resolve these problems and been unable to ride it. I bought it because it looked good, would be uber reliable and would hold it's value. I think I'm a reasonably sympathetic rider and I try and keep it clean and lubed. And this is how it repays me!

Should I sell it? Will the bills just keep getting higher?

[timbox2]

Blimey mate, all I can say is fair play for keeping her, not sure I would still be riding one with the experience youve had, think you definately got the Friday afternoon bike.
Has anybody ever suggested a new loom?, Think Im right in saying that BMW actually replaced a few under warranty in the early days.

Still not quite sure why you refer to the "relief relay", if it powers the headlights surely its the headlight relay? No? But what do I know

Thanks for all that though might help someone one day, you never know

[Paul]

Hi again MSIAWB,

Wow, you are a patient/forgiving chap with that bike of yours Regarding the rattling front discs, they can be "fixed" with the addition of some cheap (by BMW parts prices, anyway) wavey washers which go between the posts on the wheels and the brake disc.

Good luck in chasing down the fault in the electrickery setup on the bike.

Cheers,

Paul

[My S is a wife beater]

Thanks guys.

Thanks for the tip on the disc Paul. Pidocks suggested new a disc or wheel - they would - to be fair he was sympatheric after emptying my wallet already and suggested I brought it back when I'd had chance to find more money. I bought new washers and bolts from Motorworks and that has reduced it to almost normal levels (doesn't rattle when I ride over bumps) but I bet I can use the old washers on the inside. Are you sure Duct tape wouldn't sort it? I saw your signature awhile ago and it made me chuckle and I've quoted to people it since.

Timbox - I bought what should have been a genuine BMW S manual on CD-rom from a toe-rag on ebay (allegedly an S owner and he did have other S bits but he was out to rip-off his fellow riders - would surely not be caught on this forum!). The manual is fine with loads of useful stuff including wiring diargams etc but is not original only a very good copy. I'm not too miffed. I carry a print of the layout of the fuses and relay boxes with my spare bits "just in case" and it calls it the "relief relay" on there. I didn't appreciate I was being German - I will call it the headlight relay in future!

Cheers,

Adrian.