The dreaded clutch/final drive failure?

Rumplefunkskin · Post by **Rumplefunkskin** » Sat Dec 21, 2013 1:19 pm

Morning all,

Apologies for the requests for so much info from a first post, but I'm hoping the wealth of knowledge here might be able to point me down the right road....

Riding home from Xmas shopping this morning when without warning, the revs suddenly jumped and the bike started to lose all drive. Changed gear quickly in case a false neutral had happened to be greeted by a horrendous screeching from the rear of the engine.

Killed the bike as quickly as possible and got to the edge of the road to try and work out the problem. It appears as though the clutch has completely failed without warning? (happy to be corrected on this though!

The bike still runs smoothly, so that rules out the engine, and the gearbox seems to select gears without issue. However, once a gear has been selected with the engine running, the same screeching starts up again, regardless of whether the clutch is in or out. It doesn't make the noise when in neutral however.

With the engine off, and the bike in gear, it can be pushed around quite easily, so there's clearly some disconnection in drive somewhere along the system.

So, any thoughts? The bike is a 2001 R1100s with just a tad over 40,000 on the clock. It's been well looked after and fully serviced. Just couldn't have picked a worse time to fail! If it is a clutch replacement, I'll be attempting it myself. Can't afford the garage fees!

Many thanks in advance.

Tom.

oyster · Post by **oyster** » Sat Dec 21, 2013 1:33 pm

Unfortunately your bike falls into the dreadful vintage that included a batch of poor grade gearbox input shafts. The splines on it or in the centre of the clutch have departed. Shopping list if this is the case includes new input shaft and clutch. Plus as many new bearings and seals as you are inclined to renew while you are at the gearbox. All vintages suffered from an input shaft that is about 8mm too short, so there is a poor physical contact there. And further reading will reveal that the gearbox is rarely perfectly aligned to the crankshaft. Despite these issues, these are pretty tough bikes as some high milers will attest.

Merecat · Post by **Merecat** » Sat Dec 21, 2013 1:39 pm

Hello and welcome
sounds like the gearbox/clutch splines have stripped.
Not the best news at any time of the year.
Have a look here:

viewtopic.php?t=13167

There is a wealth of information on here which will help, but its major surgery time, not difficult but time consuming.

Good luck

qwakers · Post by **qwakers** » Sun Dec 22, 2013 10:56 pm

i've got a r1100 gearbox and final drive im refurbishing if your interested? will be ready in a few days...

Rumplefunkskin · Post by **Rumplefunkskin** » Thu Jan 02, 2014 7:28 pm

Many thanks for all the help and advice so far. Just in the process of stripping it down now and working out where the damage is and what needs to be replaced.

Think I'll be asking for much more help yet though.....

Qwakers - I may well be very interested in this option depending on what's needed. Do you have any more details (age, condition, mileage etc) ?

Thanks all!

Tom

qwakers · Post by **qwakers** » Fri Jan 03, 2014 9:20 am

'99, 40kmiles, no perceptible wear.

Rumplefunkskin · Post by **Rumplefunkskin** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 3:29 pm

So, after a good few hours wrestling with the exhaust bolts, I've finally got the bugger apart!

As thought, and indicated by the wise people here, the splined input shaft has indeed stripped.

Clutch:

Shaft:

So from here, next job is to split the gearbox and get the old knackered shaft out. Has anyone got any experience of what's required in terms of new seals and bearings and where to get them from? Next shaft and clutch looks like it may be Motorworks depending on stock, but unsure on what other parts might be needed!

Had a good look through the service history for my bike, and it looks as though this has happened in the past too. Found a service sheet with parts for clutch and shaft before at 20,000 miles. And now it's happened again 20,000 miles later. Not much of a confidence in the R1100s right now

Merecat · Post by **Merecat** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 5:22 pm

I think it was a problem which affected a certain vintage. A bit scary really. I think I'll stop riding mine!!

slparry · Post by **slparry** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 5:25 pm

Merecat wrote:I think it was a problem which affected a certain vintage. A bit scary really. I think I'll stop riding mine!!

what age range Mick?

Droptarotter · Post by **Droptarotter** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 6:16 pm

I think there was some info about this on Pelican??

If I remember correctly, it was related to misalignment of the gearbox to the engine.

Cheers

Rumplefunkskin · Post by **Rumplefunkskin** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 6:45 pm

slparry wrote:
Merecat wrote:I think it was a problem which affected a certain vintage. A bit scary really. I think I'll stop riding mine!!
what age range Mick?

From the info I've seen while researching this job it appears as though 2001 were the worst batch, although its certainly not limited to that year or even model. The worrying part is that if it is related to misalignment between gearbox and engine, that this is going to keep on cropping its ugly head. No idea how to properly resolve!

oyster · Post by **oyster** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 7:11 pm

Gents, for further info, read the earlier posts, it is all there.

nab 301 · Post by **nab 301** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 7:37 pm

Rumplefunkskin wrote:
slparry wrote:
Merecat wrote:I!
?
The worrying part is that if it is related to misalignment between gearbox and engine, that this is going to keep on cropping its ugly head. No idea how to properly resolve!

Misalignment issue is covered in this Pelican thread ....
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/bmw-r110 ... lines.html

quote="Rumplefunkskin"] Has anyone got any experience of what's required in terms of new seals and bearings and where to get them from? :

[/quote]Oyster posted up list of bearings and seals a while back
viewtopic.php?t=10343&start=15

Simply Bearings Ltd------------------------------------------------------Order Number: 28706

Date Ordered: Wednesday 17 June, 2009 Products------------------------------------------------------
1 x SKF 6204 Open Ball Brg 20x47x14mm (6204.SKF) = £3.21
1 x SKF 6003 Open Ball Brg 17x35x10mm (6003.SKF) = £2.74
4 x SKF 6205 Open Ball Brg 25x52x15mm (6205.SKF) = £14.68
1 x 20x32x8mm R23 NBR Oil Seal (20x32x8_TC) = £2.43
2 x 25x40x6mm R23 NBR Oil Seal (25x40x6_TC) = £2.98
1 x 17x28x7mm R21 NBR Oil Seal (17x28x7_SC) = £1.44
1 x 10x18x6mm R21 NBR Oil Seal (10x18x6_SC) = £1.40
1 x 14x22x5mm R21 NBR Oil Seal (14x22x5_SC) = £3.80
-----------Items Sub Total: £32.68

Rumplefunkskin · Post by **Rumplefunkskin** » Sun Jan 19, 2014 8:38 pm

nab 301 wrote:
Oyster posted up list of bearings and seals a while back
viewtopic.php?t=10343&start=15

Simply Bearings Ltd------------------------------------------------------Order Number: 28706

Date Ordered: Wednesday 17 June, 2009 Products------------------------------------------------------
1 x SKF 6204 Open Ball Brg 20x47x14mm (6204.SKF) = £3.21
1 x SKF 6003 Open Ball Brg 17x35x10mm (6003.SKF) = £2.74
4 x SKF 6205 Open Ball Brg 25x52x15mm (6205.SKF) = £14.68
1 x 20x32x8mm R23 NBR Oil Seal (20x32x8_TC) = £2.43
2 x 25x40x6mm R23 NBR Oil Seal (25x40x6_TC) = £2.98
1 x 17x28x7mm R21 NBR Oil Seal (17x28x7_SC) = £1.44
1 x 10x18x6mm R21 NBR Oil Seal (10x18x6_SC) = £1.40
1 x 14x22x5mm R21 NBR Oil Seal (14x22x5_SC) = £3.80
-----------Items Sub Total: £32.68

That's superb. Many thanks for that, hugely appreciated

Bruno · Post by **Bruno** » Fri Jan 24, 2014 2:22 pm

Is a gearbox rebuild a straightforward strip and rebuild or is there lots of shiming involved like an airhead?
I see that an input shaft from M/works is £170+.

Mk

www.boxertrix.com

The dreaded clutch/final drive failure?

The dreaded clutch/final drive failure?

Progress!