Engine Oil
Moderators: slparry, Gromit, Paul
Engine Oil
Guys, Any preferences or strong feelings on which engine oil and viscosity to go for?
1997 CBR1100XXV
1999 CBR1100XX
2009 HP2 Sport
2006 R1200s
2013 R1200RT anniversary
1999 CBR1100XX
2009 HP2 Sport
2006 R1200s
2013 R1200RT anniversary
No problemoPBBoxer wrote:cheers..
PB
Whilst just using a good name-branded 10w40 semi-synth works great in the motor (and change it every 3k at least) I can't stress enough the improvement using a top quality synthetic makes in the gears dept. If you can get hold of Mobil 1 gear oil (it's like rocking horse sh*t tbh) then use it. The gearchange is better, and there's also less driveline vibration.
I use fully synthetic gear oil in the MZ of all things and the difference it makes in even that little bike is quite amazing. You only need about 1.2l of the stuff (in the BM) so it's only a few quid more.
5W40 fully synthetic in the engine is fantastic. 22000 miles, runs great and burns no oil. I have not put it in the other bike yet as it only has 4000 miles on it.
I also went fully synthetic in the gearbox on my 1150RT and could not believe the difference! It will go into both S's when I find it here in France.
I also went fully synthetic in the gearbox on my 1150RT and could not believe the difference! It will go into both S's when I find it here in France.
2004 Silver (mine)
2001 Silver/Manderin (hers)
Visiting France? Read my blog on http://bikesindordogne.blogspot.com
2001 Silver/Manderin (hers)
Visiting France? Read my blog on http://bikesindordogne.blogspot.com
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bernsmartco
- Posts: 214
- Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2004 6:53 pm
- Location: Worcester
PB,
Depends how many miles the engins done?
Book says 20 50 brand name G4 or G5 classification but most recommend using this only for the first 10K miles by which time the engin is starting to get run in then switching to semi synth for another 10K before changing to fully synth.
Grom is spot on with the gearbox and diff. fully synth made a difference in mine.
If you ever get over to France stock up on oils there. the big hyper-markets seem to stock all sorts and its half the price.
Depends how many miles the engins done?
Book says 20 50 brand name G4 or G5 classification but most recommend using this only for the first 10K miles by which time the engin is starting to get run in then switching to semi synth for another 10K before changing to fully synth.
Grom is spot on with the gearbox and diff. fully synth made a difference in mine.
If you ever get over to France stock up on oils there. the big hyper-markets seem to stock all sorts and its half the price.
Ride safely
Bern.
Bern.
Agreed - we stock up on Mobil 1 Diesel oil for the c*r when we're over there. Approx 18 quid for 4 litres as opposed to 35-ish over here. I'll check out the bike oils next time we're there.bernsmartco wrote:
If you ever get over to France stock up on oils there. the big hyper-markets seem to stock all sorts and its half the price.
Rip-off Britain??? Yeah right....
Sure - if the bike's done a fair few miles then by all means go for fully-synth in the motor. Personally (and I know folk may well do different, but that's always their shout) I'll just use the Halfords semi 10w40 and change it every 2k, stays nice and clean too. 20 quid for 5 litres.
IMHO the mileage is very relevant. The best (by far) BMW gearbox I have ever used in 26 yrs of off-and-on BMW ownership was a 48000 miler that had not been particularly well serviced ( in fact it had only had things repaired when they broke) and it was running on Halfords basic g/box oil. Not even the correct viscosity rating just an approximate!!!
As far as the engine goes, my current bike has done 3900 miles; had its first service oil change using basic 20-50 and has also had its 1 yr service oil change (at 3.5K)using Castrol mineral 20-50 (specially requested by me), and has not needed topping up at any time in spite of being unmercifully 'thraped' since 500 miles. In fact the oil level in the window has never varied.
It is a very old engine design and I am sorry, but for an engine like this, I am totally unconvinced by super special synthetics (or even semi-synthetics)at millions of pounds per litre.
Mind you, if you have got an worn out oil-burner the situation is very different. In that case I can recommend Selenia HPX 10- 60 Fully Synthetic. It was (in those days) not very expensive and used to work very well in knackered old Lancia Integrale's. Our knickname for it was - 'superglue'
Horses for courses
Sandbar
As far as the engine goes, my current bike has done 3900 miles; had its first service oil change using basic 20-50 and has also had its 1 yr service oil change (at 3.5K)using Castrol mineral 20-50 (specially requested by me), and has not needed topping up at any time in spite of being unmercifully 'thraped' since 500 miles. In fact the oil level in the window has never varied.
It is a very old engine design and I am sorry, but for an engine like this, I am totally unconvinced by super special synthetics (or even semi-synthetics)at millions of pounds per litre.
Mind you, if you have got an worn out oil-burner the situation is very different. In that case I can recommend Selenia HPX 10- 60 Fully Synthetic. It was (in those days) not very expensive and used to work very well in knackered old Lancia Integrale's. Our knickname for it was - 'superglue'
Horses for courses
Sandbar
Serious question - why do folk say this? It's often quoted in the mags ('based on a 1923 design blah blah') but I've often wondered is it really an old design? An old, and somewhat unfashionable configuration maybe.sandbar wrote: It is a very old engine design
The inline l/cooled 4 cylinder has been in production far longer but would one say the same about a Yamazukondawaki ZXCBGSYZR900RRRRRRRRR?
The R259 is an 8 valve hi-cam twin, ok big deal, but you don't hear of the Ducati 2-valvers being described in the same manner. Ok, they've got Dismalchronic valve actuation (in itself totally unnecessary with modern metallurgy & engineering) but they're hardly cutting-edge.
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Boxadog 2000
- Member
- Posts: 1908
- Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2004 8:29 pm
- Location: Looking over hedges
Err well yes it is an old design but there again you could say that about any four stroke or two stroke come to think of it.
I know its controversial but when folk say ahh still the same as when they made them in 19??? 20 something I just say have you got one ? No ok then feck off.
I do tollerate some comments though.
Bob
Still has a bike with a 1925 engine yeah get real
I know its controversial but when folk say ahh still the same as when they made them in 19??? 20 something I just say have you got one ? No ok then feck off.
I do tollerate some comments though.
Bob
Still has a bike with a 1925 engine yeah get real
My 1923 engine has done 6500 miles.
Is it really true the loosen up after so many miles? Mine feels pretty good now... will it get better... and if so when hehe
i'll have to check what jeffires have been putting in it. they gave me a 5 litre container so i'll check, but I'm pretty sure its already on fully synthetic. I have to say I'm pretty much with the school of thought that a run of the mill semi synthetic oil should do well, as the motor is hardly a high revving highly tuned manic thing eh?
So would peopel agree that a semi synthetic engine oil for a few more thou... but fully synthetic gearbox oil, were the way to go?
Is it really true the loosen up after so many miles? Mine feels pretty good now... will it get better... and if so when hehe
i'll have to check what jeffires have been putting in it. they gave me a 5 litre container so i'll check, but I'm pretty sure its already on fully synthetic. I have to say I'm pretty much with the school of thought that a run of the mill semi synthetic oil should do well, as the motor is hardly a high revving highly tuned manic thing eh?
So would peopel agree that a semi synthetic engine oil for a few more thou... but fully synthetic gearbox oil, were the way to go?
1997 CBR1100XXV
1999 CBR1100XX
2009 HP2 Sport
2006 R1200s
2013 R1200RT anniversary
1999 CBR1100XX
2009 HP2 Sport
2006 R1200s
2013 R1200RT anniversary
The fully synthetics for gearboxes message is certainly well established. I think it started in the late 70's with brands from the US with (for the time) weird sounding names.
For the engines I suspect that we are witnessing a triumph (no offence intended) of marketing over substance.
Whether we like it or not, within the subject of this thread, it is an old design. We are talking about oils and that means we are concerned with the rings and the bearings etc. Of course there have been dimensional changes and also a host of minor changes, but as far as I am aware things are much the same in those areas as they have ever been. Peak revs are not much higher than my first BMW (R100RS 1978), so piston and bearing speeds are much of a muchness.
In order to keep warranty claims down BMW needs us to 'bed' in the engines properly and to do that it would like us to use fairly simple mineral oil. Once the engine is working well and hopefully not using oil and running smoothly, then it wants to up-the-ante and start to take some serious money off us.
My feeling on this is that the engine does not have to deal with 14-15000 rpm like some of the Jap engines and therefore the oil that we use has got a different job to do. Unless compromises are made, then in a perfect world it will need a different oil. However, if we can be persuaded that all our engines need an oil that can deal with 14-15000rpm and also go through a red hot turbocharger rotating at 60-100000 rpm and also start the family run-about after a week parked outside at -10 then it will make life very easy for the oil companies. Just imagine how good it would be if the oil companies could then charge a fortune for it!!
The oil companies are past masters at this kind of thing. A technical guy from Esso (no - it wasn't the Esso Blee Dooler for those old enough to remember) told me that Esso own Comma because they want a slice of the budget oils market. However there is too much cost involved in having two separate production facilities so basically they are the same oils. They have to achieve the same standards so apart from a bit of colouring, a few minor additives and of course the packaging they are to all intents and purposes the same products.
The most outrageous calumny perpetrated recently by the oil companies and the car manufacturers is the use of the same oil in diesel and petrol engines. Two totally different environments - one common oil. I do not think so!!
IMHO - of course
Rant over - phew, I got quite worked up there!!
Sandbar
For the engines I suspect that we are witnessing a triumph (no offence intended) of marketing over substance.
Whether we like it or not, within the subject of this thread, it is an old design. We are talking about oils and that means we are concerned with the rings and the bearings etc. Of course there have been dimensional changes and also a host of minor changes, but as far as I am aware things are much the same in those areas as they have ever been. Peak revs are not much higher than my first BMW (R100RS 1978), so piston and bearing speeds are much of a muchness.
In order to keep warranty claims down BMW needs us to 'bed' in the engines properly and to do that it would like us to use fairly simple mineral oil. Once the engine is working well and hopefully not using oil and running smoothly, then it wants to up-the-ante and start to take some serious money off us.
My feeling on this is that the engine does not have to deal with 14-15000 rpm like some of the Jap engines and therefore the oil that we use has got a different job to do. Unless compromises are made, then in a perfect world it will need a different oil. However, if we can be persuaded that all our engines need an oil that can deal with 14-15000rpm and also go through a red hot turbocharger rotating at 60-100000 rpm and also start the family run-about after a week parked outside at -10 then it will make life very easy for the oil companies. Just imagine how good it would be if the oil companies could then charge a fortune for it!!
The oil companies are past masters at this kind of thing. A technical guy from Esso (no - it wasn't the Esso Blee Dooler for those old enough to remember) told me that Esso own Comma because they want a slice of the budget oils market. However there is too much cost involved in having two separate production facilities so basically they are the same oils. They have to achieve the same standards so apart from a bit of colouring, a few minor additives and of course the packaging they are to all intents and purposes the same products.
The most outrageous calumny perpetrated recently by the oil companies and the car manufacturers is the use of the same oil in diesel and petrol engines. Two totally different environments - one common oil. I do not think so!!
IMHO - of course
Rant over - phew, I got quite worked up there!!
Sandbar