www.boxertrix.com

fontana wrote:

milleplod wrote:I seriously doubt that any reputable dealer would put 'sold as seen' on an invoice, that would be inviting problems I would've thought. But, as I said above, putting it into context as used on the eBay listing, its a phrase that anyone with any common sense would surely understand.

Pete

So then using the common sense you say I lack, define "sold as seen" in the context of the add..
I'll then contact the dealership and find out if you're right.

Really? .... why does everything have to be an argument and a fight, why do you have this desire ... nay need to be "right" all the time? Were you bullied as a child? Do you have an issue with authority? It puzzles me why you just cannot play "nice" like just about everyone else without snide remarks about not criticising your perceived select group.

It's getting really tedious now how you twist everything into an argument, yet hide behind the keyboard and the anonymity of not having to provide any real world contact information as of course in the real world you'd not dare to speak to people the way you do or you'd probably end up decked by someone who would quickly take umbrage at your abrasive argumentative style.

Please just bloody play nice. We're here to chat not to praise Fontana for being the God of being right all the damn time!

Steve, you must know you are wasting you time, this guy is toxic, self opinionated, and a waste of a good skin, who as you say is only capable of communicating from behind the anonymity of a keyboard and really should be ignored by everybody so that he might crawl back under his stone, it is quite plain to see that many regular forum regulars are now less active and the friendly banter that made this site what it was is now missing. I have hit the ignore button, it is your friend

Al.

Al wrote:Steve, you must know you are wasting you time, this guy is toxic, self opinionated, and a waste of a good skin, who as you say is only capable of communicating from behind the anonymity of a keyboard and really should be ignored by everybody so that he might crawl back under his stone, it is quite plain to see that many regular forum regulars are now less active and the friendly banter that made this site what it was is now missing. I have hit the ignore button, it is your friend

Al.

Hit.....very hard!

Pete

slparry wrote: Really? .... why does everything have to be an argument and a fight, why do you have this desire ... nay need to be "right" all the time? Were you bullied as a child? Do you have an issue with authority? It puzzles me why you just cannot play "nice" like just about everyone else without snide remarks about not criticising your perceived select group.!

Could you give your interpretation of the phrase sold as seen, from a dealer perspective, and in relation to the bikes you sell ?
You might be able to clear it up for me, as a few here say I'm wrong.

Herb wrote: Common sense and the law don't always go hand in hand. I think the phrase is being misused, probably by the motor industry as a whole, simply through naivety of laws / guidelines that are clearly not being enforced!

100% agree.

Herb wrote:I am no expert, but as far as I can see (and as much as it pains me to say it) Fontana seems to be correct.

Dealers quite simply should not be using the terminology 'sold as seen' when selling to the public. I am sure there is more appropriate terminology that conveys the same message, that the bike or car or whatever is sold without a specific warranty, but the consumers rights are unaffected.

Again correct, although they don't need to point out consumers rights are unaffected.
That goes without saying.
A dealer cannot under any circumstances shirk their responsibilities in this respect.

Al wrote:Steve, you must know you are wasting you time, this guy is toxic, self opinionated, and a waste of a good skin, who as you say is only capable of communicating from behind the anonymity of a keyboard and really should be ignored by everybody so that he might crawl back under his stone, it is quite plain to see that many regular forum regulars are now less active and the friendly banter that made this site what it was is now missing. I have hit the ignore button, it is your friend

Al.

Well I haven't ever had to resort to childish name calling at least.


Oh and here's another little interesting fact that dealers don't like to be widely known.
If you buy a bike unseen from a dealer some distance away unseen, off ebay for example, you can reject it if it doesn't meet expectations.
You don't have to give a reason either.
The reason for that is distance selling regulations (now know as consumer contracts regulations)
As always.
KNOW YOUR RIGHTS.
Don't let the dealers get one over.

You just can't help yourself can you? Yet again, you have taken an innocuous thread and turned it into an accusation that Steve/Chester Motorrad are somehow unscrupulously trying to sell an old, but well preserved bike onto an unsuspecting public, and then having made that accusation you challenge Steve to disprove it.

You are poisoning this board with you stupid fabricated arguments. Cease and desist please! This is absolutely your final warning on this topic. The next time you start one of these gratuitously argumentative threads you will be banned and all of your posts deleted. Enough is enough!

Paul

Paul wrote:You just can't help yourself can you? Yet again, you have taken an innocuous thread and turned it into an accusation that Steve/Chester Motorrad are somehow unscrupulously trying to sell an old, but well preserved bike onto an unsuspecting public, and then having made that accusation you challenge Steve to disprove it.

You are poisoning this board with you stupid fabricated arguments. Cease and desist please! This is absolutely your final warning on this topic. The next time you start one of these gratuitously argumentative threads you will be banned and all of your posts deleted. Enough is enough!

Paul

Well said Paul, I have kept out of all the recent "discusions" created by this poster BUT as you say Enough is Enough!. Long may Boxertrix continue but not like this please.

Peter.

Oh ban me then.
FFS you're being a bit childish.
No one has held a gun to anyone's head forcing them to respond to my posts.
Are you Men, or just a bunch of delicate sensitive little flowers.
MAN UP FFS.
GROW A PAIR AND STOP BEING SUCH A BUNCH OF WHIMPS.
Oh and Paul.
You can't delete all of my posts and you know it.
See you all in Wales.
Until then that's all from me.

fontana wrote:Oh ban me then.
FFS you're being a bit childish.
No one has held a gun to anyone's head forcing them to respond to my posts.
Are you Men, or just a bunch of delicate sensitive little flowers.
MAN UP FFS.
GROW A PAIR AND STOP BEING SUCH A BUNCH OF WHIMPS.
Oh and Paul.
You can't delete all of my posts and you know it.
See you all in Wales.
Until then that's all from me.

Wimps.

fontana wrote:

milleplod wrote:I've no doubt that the bike Chester Motorrad have got listed will come with some sort of very basic warranty (3 months?) - I can't really see them trying to get out of any of their legal responsibilities, can you? Unless, of course, you're not in any way whatsoever alluding to Steve's post....

OK so what do you suppose sold as seen means, in the context of the bike being referred too.

milleplod wrote:And I don't believe that the use of the phrase 'sold as seen' is illegal. It may very well not mean anything, because the Consumer Rights Act 2015 negates anything like that anyway, but its not illegal to use it. Unless you can point us to the legislation that says it is, of course!

Pete

Here ya go

"It is an offence to display any sign which tries to limit a buyer's rights. Do not use signs like 'No Refunds' or 'Sold as Seen'. As well as being illegal, these signs do not, in fact, limit buyers' rights at all".

That's straight from the fair trading act.

Are you forgetting "buyer be aware" or what seems" to good to be true" actually means just that. Contract is a two way thing.

Well said Paul, I have kept out of all the recent "discusions" created by this poster BUT as you say Enough is Enough!. Long may Boxertrix continue but not like this please.
[/quote]
Agreed, ditto..no need for these forums to be spoilt

Well the simple answer is if you don't think a post is relevant, don't respond.
As I said, no one is holding a gun to anyone's head here, and for an argument to take place, it takes at least two to participate.
It's also interesting that I have never once used name calling and personal abuse.
Others have, but yet I'm the one who get's threatened with being banished.

This forum is definitely a cosy little clique, where the rules don't apply to the elite few.
Anyway, I'm sure we'll all be able to clear the air in Wales next month.

Fontana, You are accusing Steve/Chester Motorrad of using a trick to illegally foist a motorcycle onto the unsuspecting public, thus potentially damaging their reputation. If he does not respond then you crow that he is tacitly acknowledging your "truth". You are therefore drag people into these arguments, because if they don't engage with you you claim that it is because they acknowledge your version of the truth.

You also say it takes two to make an argument, but it seems to be consistently you that is first into the ring.

I hope you do come along to Wales, because you will meet a genuinely friendly and helpful bunch of people and it might give you cause to think about why you constantly seem to want to aggravate and infuriate them.

Paul

Paul wrote:Fontana, You are accusing Steve/Chester Motorrad of using a trick to illegally foist a motorcycle onto the unsuspecting public, thus potentially damaging their reputation. If he does not respond then you crow that he is tacitly acknowledging your "truth". You are therefore drag people into these arguments, because if they don't engage with you you claim that it is because they acknowledge your version of the truth.

You also say it takes two to make an argument, but it seems to be consistently you that is first into the ring.

I hope you do come along to Wales, because you will meet a genuinely friendly and helpful bunch of people and it might give you cause to think about why you constantly seem to want to aggravate and infuriate them.

Paul

Well I didn't accuse Steve of anything.
I just bought into question the use of the words sold as seen used by the company he works for.
This is illegal, and I provided a link to prove it.
Anyway that same member who's professional sensibilities I'm being told to be more considerate of, is quite happy to point the finger disparagingly at other dealerships.

http://boxertrix.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.p ... ue#p184536

I can't make the whole Wales weekend but I'll be up for one of the days or evenings.
Then people will see that whilst I am opinionated and make no apologies for that, I am a decent person not worthy of a lot of the nasty personal abuse I've received on this forum, that you do nothing to address.

Why am I not surprised that you cannot make the whole weekend, Tell us when you will be there as I would like to witness your appearance!! In my very humble opinion you just seem to like confrontation (only via the keyboard) and this board has become a poorer place because of this.

Peter.

PS, Thought you were finished here until Wales (you did say that yesterday morning)

fontana wrote:I can't make the whole Wales weekend but I'll be up for one of the days or evenings.
Then people will see that whilst I am opinionated and make no apologies for that, I am a decent person not worthy of a lot of the nasty personal abuse I've received on this forum, that you do nothing to address.

Fontana,

Having an opinion is nothing to apologise for. Denigrating other people's differing opinions and asking them to justify holding a view which differs from yours is where you win no friends on this board. If you could simply accept that other people do not share your views on 100% of topics and leave it at that, all would be fine. I might disagree with your view on, for example, the merits of shaft drive versus chain drive, but that doesn't make either of us wrong and is not worth getting into a pointlessly aggressive argument over.

If you just chill a little, people won't constantly feel they have to be on the defensive with you. Please do come to Wales and I'll be the first to buy you a beer. Talk with us, get to know us a bit better, and I'm sure we will all rub along nicely, once we understand each other better.

One of the defining characteristics of this site, which I'm keen to preserve, is that a large proportion of the people on this board do meet up regularly in real life and can put a face to a name for most of the regular posters. I think that contributes in a large part to the normally good humoured atmosphere on this site, which most people on here appreciate. If you are perceived as being unusually confrontational or provoking arguments, people are reacting to that. The name calling is, I agree, regrettable and out of character with the usual tone of the site. I'm sure if you stop initiating arguments with the other site members that would stop too.

Paul