If your starter starts messing about when cranking then gives up completely just doing the 'machine-gun-clack", it could be this:
My starter failed with a fractured magnet and a kind forum member @boxerscott sent me a spare parts one which 'had problems' which he had long since replaced. I figured that I would only need to change the housing with magnets to get a working starter motor.
It turns out that on both of these starters the grease flinger disc had become loose on the armature and the magnets had pulled the disc towards the winding and worn away the insulation causing the armature winding to arc through the disc, effectively dead-shorting the unit. Here is the armature removed from the starter and the rather battered disc, you can see both where the copper is exposed from the armature rubbing on the loose disc and the hot spots on the disc where the arc has been passing through it. To remove the armature you have to remove the brushes then gently pry the plastic end housing off the metal casing and copper posts. Pull off the grease cap and remove a small clip that holds the shaft in.
Now if you have a starter that's been messing about when cranking then gone on to just rapid-clacking when the button is pressed, this might be the cause. A short-term fix would be to strip off the motor and remove that plate, then there is nothing to short against but equally there's no longer any barrier between the motor and the epicyclic reduction box.
My remedy, because I have the tools to do it, was to re-insulate the windings and make a new flinger. I got some winding sealer left over from another job and painted it over the exposed winding ends
Whilst that was drying I turned a new flinger from all bar, and pressed it on to the armature stopping just short of touching. The flinger is 1mm thick and the hole in the hub 12.3mm
Re-fitting the armature into the housing. It has 2 thin washers and a small clip under the grease cap.
Scrape out the dry grease from the grease cap, add about 1/4 full of fresh grease and gently tap it back in place
When you re-fit the brushes you'll have to hold the housing in place whilst re-fitting the metal end cap, or the brush springs will push it upwards. It's a simple task.
So, with the new flinger in place (and not shorting the windings) the starter went back in and works perfectly once more. As I said above, in a pinch you might get away without the metal flinger for a while, though I suspect that it would eventually get fouled with debris from the gearbox. You could even try aralditing the disc back on with a paper shim inside to stop it shorting on the exposed copper, if you fancied it might work.
Starter repair
Moderators: Gromit, Paul, slparry
Re: Starter repair
Good job!
Very satisfying to repair rather than replace, although you obviously have a very good technical expertise and a well equipped workshop.
Very satisfying to repair rather than replace, although you obviously have a very good technical expertise and a well equipped workshop.
Motorrad R1250RS SE 2023
Blue R100RS 1980
Suzuki GT250B 1977
Blue R100RS 1980
Suzuki GT250B 1977
- jeznewsome
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Re: Starter repair
nice work
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Re: Starter repair
Quality post. Practical and technical.
(Think I made the right decision to replace!)
Chris.
(Think I made the right decision to replace!)
Chris.
Fiat Panda.
Fiat Scudo (with speedblock, pipe carrier, reversing sensors, reversing camera, tow bar, some new rust and Fake Plumber logo)
started out with nothing, still have most of it left.
Fiat Scudo (with speedblock, pipe carrier, reversing sensors, reversing camera, tow bar, some new rust and Fake Plumber logo)
started out with nothing, still have most of it left.
Re: Starter repair
Well done Pete - a man after my own heart. A cheapskate with a good engineering knowledge and machine tools in the garage!
Reminds me of the F800 I fixed a few years ago and the sat nav mount I did last night on my K12RS out of the scrap box.
Reminds me of the F800 I fixed a few years ago and the sat nav mount I did last night on my K12RS out of the scrap box.
John M
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- Member
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- Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2005 4:35 am
- Location: North East
Re: Starter repair
John, I still have that old starter I promised you when we spoke a couple of years ago!! It still has your name on it if we could manage to meet up. A few things have happened in my life (nothing serious at all) but I don't get out on there bike as much as I want (again, nothing physical wrong but many tasks to complete)
'15 R1200GS TE
'06 R1200S
'04 BCR
Yam SR 500 long term restoration
wanna win the lottery and ride my bike
'06 R1200S
'04 BCR
Yam SR 500 long term restoration
wanna win the lottery and ride my bike
Re: Starter repair
Thank you all. I love to fix up stuff rather than buy new if I can. I do have a good selection of machine tools etc (my hobby is rebuilding them) so making a simple part like this is a no-brainer for me. Hopefully, when the time comes to retire my workshop will be complete and I can spend my time using machines more than rebuilding them.
Re: Starter repair
Yes Dave - I hadn't forgotten the starter. Just that medical issues prevented me all last year and I'm just emerging now. I'll maybe sort a ride out with Mr Parry up your way fairly soon and we can grab a lunch somewhere in the middle and have a bit of a catch up as well. Sounds like a plan anyway.
John M
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- Member
- Posts: 3625
- Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2005 4:35 am
- Location: North East
Re: Starter repair
I know the feeling John. I’m no longer driving a wagon - white (well silver) van man delivering truck parts. Lot less money but regular hours. At present sat outside a hotel in France heading towards the French Alps. I’ll give you a call when I get back
'15 R1200GS TE
'06 R1200S
'04 BCR
Yam SR 500 long term restoration
wanna win the lottery and ride my bike
'06 R1200S
'04 BCR
Yam SR 500 long term restoration
wanna win the lottery and ride my bike
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